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Post by flossyinoz on Apr 23, 2008 15:35:00 GMT 10
Doris,
I am not worrying too much about it and will try to present the house in a normal state, not sparkling clean and tidy like in a designer magazine as this is a house which is lived in. It will be rather interesting what potential dangers they see in our house and garden for a child which we don't see.
But the panel that is really something to worry about. What kind of questions do they ask? Do they try to intimidate you? Can you answer honestly? For example the question with the autistic children. Frankly my honest answer would be that most autistic children shut their parents out, also personal body contact. I would like to hug and cuddle my kids a lot as that is something I did not get much in my childhood and would be crucial for a relationship with a kid. What was your reasoning and answer?
Flossyinoz
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Post by doris on Apr 23, 2008 16:20:04 GMT 10
hi Flozzy
ok with the autism question i told them the truth. my husband and i dont have children and we want to be able to connect with the child if placed with us. i told them that i have been around autisic children and a couple of my friends have autistic children and i feel i am not strong enough to handle a child that will not connect with me. the questions that this particualr person was putting to me was trying to make out i didn't know what i was talking about. but i did know. and i knew when she mentioned it that i had to be truthful and tell it as it is.
regarding the panel, well it was a very strange day. i was not nervous at all before we went in. but during i started to feel really nervous, and when i get nervous i start to talk alot. and talk i did. the questions they asked us were not to hard. i guess the hardest question was about a child with autism. we were asked what will you do if the child that is placed with you does not meet your expectations academically. and again i started to talk (i have to say i did do the majority of the talking) and i was truthful. i mean a child can only achieve what they can achieve and the child should not be punished for it. i threw in an example of me. where i wanted to do something but knew i could never do it. i am trying to think of something else. it was almost 18 months ago. if i can remember more i will let you know.
it did go on for about an hour, then after we left thats when i got really nervous. our case worker said we did really well and we should get a phone call in about 2 hours. So we decided to go out for lunch to celebrate that it was all over and during lunch they called us that we were successfull. thats when we started to call all our family and friends.
Doris
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Post by flossyinoz on Apr 23, 2008 16:43:31 GMT 10
Doris, Thanks for answering this so quickly. So a similar answer that I would have given - the whole connection thing not only on a physical but also emotional level. And especially with a kid that comes into your life later this is the major point. Did you have the feeling apart from this one woman that they were supportive and wanted to let you pass or did you ahve the feeling they wanted to see you fail which would be ridiculous and would also question the skills of their own social workers and the whole system. Glad about any flashes you can give me And best of luck with your agency and hopefully an call soon that you have been linked with a child. Flossyinoz
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Post by chinababe on Apr 26, 2008 20:53:08 GMT 10
samnangmeh Hi Babe it's good to see where your at with your stuff. The only stuff I can really answer for you is in what I am legally entilied to through my work in terms of adoptive leave. It states in my work documentation that I am allowed 12mths unpaid adoption leave and that I need to give 12wks notice - which I pointed out to my boss that this is unlikely and that it needs to be changed to 8 weeks. There is also lead way with the committee that overseas the service I work for. So I am guessing if I was doing PC they would work with me regardless and I would prep then as much as I could once I was at a stage where a placement might take place.
The autism discussion is interesting and I am going to throw a real spanner in the works here by bringing up the concept of RAD (reactive attachment disorder). Those of you that prefer not to accept a child with autism what will you do if you receive a placement and the child at a later stage shows signs of RAD? I am assuming if they showed signs of this before the placement takes place you have the chance to refuse the placement - which I think is actually a very brave thing to do and important to think about and also not to be too harsh on yourself if you chose to wait for another placement. But what happens if it this conditions come out at a later point? I guess part of the reason I ask this is because there seems to be quite a few resources and supports in the wider community for autistic kids but less is known or govt supported for RAD kids
Also just to prove how thick I am someone explain to me Sal are you ahead of Flossy in the process? Or is Flossy ahead of you?
As for us I can't remember everything we said yes or no too in terms of ICA but do remember that we are willing to accept incest situations where the genetic risks are low - but not I have had more research into this we realise that in general the risks are pretty low anyway.
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Post by chinababe on Apr 26, 2008 20:58:46 GMT 10
It's okay I see it in another thread! next time CB read a bit more! ;D
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Post by sallyg on Apr 28, 2008 9:57:00 GMT 10
lol - I think you've now seen that flossy is up to her final interview (I think) and I've just finished our sessions - with paperwork in had. I don't know how many months that puts me behind flossy (5ish??) - depends on SW availability I think... we're trying to do our bit asap!
Sal
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Post by flossyinoz on Apr 28, 2008 14:05:32 GMT 10
Hi all, By the way Wednesday is going to be interview number 3 with home visit, this is not going to be the last one, I would assume we will have 1-2 more. In terms of "how far behind Sal is" it took us 9 months after having all paperwork in to get social workers for assessment which is supposed to be longer than normal due to personell shortages at our agency. Chinababe - I did not want to be a complete idiot and read up on RAD Yes you are right, that would be extremely hard to cope with, but I would nevertheless prefer it to autism for the following reasons: Autism is a "brain wiring problem" from the start, children can improve through therapy, but I doubt you can ever "heal" them. RAD however is a problem of trust for a caregiver not learned during the first years in live which some adoptive/pc children develop. So a before normally wired brain develops wrong pathways. Depending on when the child is placed into good care (the earlier the better) with attachment parenting and therapy some to most of the child trust issues can be worked on and trust re-learned so that in the ideal case the child's brain and child develops normally. Of course there are a lot of grey zones and extent and results depend on each case. I guess we all know parenting won't be easy and we can only do our best and hope that the particular child we will get does not have the worst issues imaginable. It is quite frightening what kind of issues kids can have and even more unimaginable what kinds of horrors they must have gone through in their little lives to come to the conclusion adults cannot be trusted. I am prepared to parent a child who with more than usual tlc and therpay can live a happy, fulfilled and "normal" life lateron. I am not prepared to parent a child who even with the best of care will never be able to live a "normal" life that being due to a mental illness or other severe handicap. Flossyinoz
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Post by sallyg on Apr 28, 2008 14:53:38 GMT 10
Gosh Flossy, given that I might be a year behind you! Argh! Time will tell... (patience sally, patience)... so do you have 4 or 5 interviews before the panel then?
To add to the autism debate - as well as many other 'undesirable conditions' - that taking on any child that we have not grown through our own inter-uterine care, with our own 'known' genetic issues, that there is a higher risk of 'unknown' things going 'wrong' or developing. That said, I too would 'prefer' not to have a child with autism, but if the baby we adopt ends up with autism or RAD or is deaf or blind, that we will do everything possible to help its development. I wouldn't say 'we couldn't have a child with autism' as even if we say 'no' to this condition it still may develop - and whatever happens we will be committed to that child - just as if I had given birth to a child that develops autism.
I think it's completely normal to wish / want for a healthy child however our children come to us,. And chinababe you're right in saying that we do need to prepare for the myriad of conditions that may develop as this risks of unknowns is so much higher.
I just hope that all the children that come to each of us bring happiness to all, no matter what their health. Fingers crossed... We couldn't be doubly cursed - infertility and unhappy parents/children... i just can't believe it... It has to be good! (sorry for raaaaaaaaaamble)
Sal
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Post by chinababe on Apr 29, 2008 6:38:45 GMT 10
Flossy yes you do raise a good point about it being a brain wired condition. I guess part of my reason for challenging the discussion is that I have worked with quite a few children that are under the spectrum umberalla of autism. There can be such a wide variation. Then there are kinship care children that I have worked with that where placed in care very early but their inutero (sorry sp?)care has badly damaged their social processing links. I guess I also am more considering the perspective of RAD where even the range of different therapy's and parenting might have been left to late and other phsyological issues come to the fore when I am comparing it to autism (I guess in many ways I am thinking about the older child situation, not that I am saying RAD doesn't occur for younger children but in general we heard about treatment and parenting being more successful hey!). I think I basically think too much Maybe it's all the study I am doing is making me think just a little too deeply on the topic!
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Post by flossyinoz on Apr 29, 2008 9:30:34 GMT 10
China - your post re RAD really got me thinking and sparked a discussion with DH which is good at this point as we have to still fill in the "shopping list".
I am getting a bit frightened by all the disorders a child can come with which makes me think what I can cope with. As previously said I think autism or even the lighter Aspergers (if known) would be a no for me as well as a heavy case of RAD especially for the reason that in my childhood I did get a lot of love from my parents but no physical hugging - was just not my parents thing. And I myself am quite the cuddly type and it would "kill me" if a child would permanently pull away from me, not letting itself be cuddled etc. as often in RAD. But on saying this there are so many degrees and probably with most kids with special effort you get them to trust again and open up to you.
Frankly I do not know yet how to fill this into our shopping list without getting to hear from the social workers that potentially all pc kids come with RAD and being grilled at the panel for having false expectations or unfit parents. I just could not cope with a "hopeless case" who would never show his/her emotions.
China, yes you have the advantage and the disadvantage of your studies. I am a layperson and know neither the practical nor theoretical side of child disorders apart from superficail reading which on the other hand may be a bonus as I may approach a child not with a predisposed raster of what disorder they may have as social workers clearly do. They always look for the fault in the attachement or parenting. And many behaviours can be interpreted so many ways. Without consistent evidence many fast diagnoses are useless.
And Sal I agree with you that there is no giving back a child once you have it. If he/she has RAD or is deaf or whatever then we have to deal with it and do the best you can. But I would like to exclude special conditions/tendencies if they are known beforehand.
Flossyinoz
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Post by sallyg on Apr 29, 2008 11:01:51 GMT 10
I agree with you Flossy - it is all quite overwhelming. But remember if you were pregnant and started to read the stats on what could go wrong you could equally go mad! Try not to stress too much - I think you are quite clear in what you want and your SW should be able to help interpret this for you. And most of us don't have that insight into kids with special needs like china does.
One great advantage (in my view) of PC over ICA is that a PC child will be well evaluated and observed and good, honest advice given to you - not such an assurance with a child assessed in an overseas institution.
That does put you, as a prospective parent, in a much better situation to determine if that child is right for you. Having the child in a local foster family (hopefully a wonderful one) will give a real insight into how the child has developed since being removed from its initial detrimental situation.
I feel it's best to be a little more 'open' (if in doubt) to things right now, knowing that you can explore the details of an individual child offered to you in more detail as is relevant.
S
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Post by flossyinoz on Apr 29, 2008 11:49:52 GMT 10
Sal, Your post is really "a source of wisdom" and I mean that. I so agree that in pc you at least get some sort of insight of the history of a child which you do not get with ICA. The only thing I do not like about it is the relative legal insecurity. And yes you are right more open is better for the start and just excluding your major worries. Just refusing a placement offered to you may not be the best "political option" later. And I also hope for a child who lived with wonderful foster parents. It will then be hard for these kids to leave, but they will have formed a bond with their caregivers, which means they can do it again with us. And yes I am a big worrier But on saying that, I like to explore options ahead of time to be prepared when I need to be which lessens the stress later (I hope Flossyinoz
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Post by sallyg on Apr 29, 2008 12:22:03 GMT 10
Call me Sally Lama ;-)
I meant what I said about PC - we feel it's really the right way for us, in some ways better than LA. I don't worry about the legal aspect at all - in all the years of PC a bio parent has never been successful in getting a child back.
I agree, refusing a PC child wouldn't be the best, and would be an excruciating decision, but I think if you had a good SW they would view that as maturity rather than just being fussy... but that's a big 'if' (ie a good SW! lol...) -
but beyond that, I think a SW should have a good 'feel' for what you'd be happy with and wouldn't (or shouldn't) put you up for a child they think wouldn't meet your criteria. And perhaps if you decided against the placement maybe others wouldn't be up for it either.
Since there are more and more kids coming through PC, and (apparently) a desperate shortage of parents, they'd be fools to penalise you for not accepting a match.
Stop stressing woman! ;-) ... stressing now will not help you later! lol...
s
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Post by sallyg on Apr 29, 2008 12:59:33 GMT 10
OMG - just switched on Oprah and it's about autism.. running off to watch it.
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Post by flossyinoz on Apr 29, 2008 15:30:42 GMT 10
Oh Sally Lama! You start to sound like DH who keeps telling me to stop stressing (if I did and had his lax attitude towards some things, then nothing would ever be done, but that is a different story ) Well and the thing with the "good social workers", we will see, hard to say after having to spill your innermost history and feelings out to them and not knowing the slightest thing about them in return, a bit one sided. But I guess we will just have to trust them and hope for the best. So has Oprah brought you "wisdom" about autism or are you now totally confused? Flossyinoz
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Post by sallyg on Apr 29, 2008 17:40:13 GMT 10
sorry, didn't mean to sound like your dh!!!
To be honest, I don't know much about autism (and every other thing we need to tick), but was quite shocked at how 'bad' these kids were... I thought there would have been more of a scale as to how it effected people, but looking at that show it was a very severe disability. The kids shown were reaching normal milestones then suddenly 'clicked' and turned autistic - is that usual? They were mostly around 2 years of age... they said they knew there is genetic influence, but the other trigger they don't know... although all of these kids got sick before it effected them which makes you think it's a virus... it now effects 1 in 150 US kids - is it that great here? Chinababe??
Makes me want to ask for a pc kid 2-12 years old!
S
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